How should Switzerland relieve congestion on its motorways?
On November 24 Swiss voters will decide on a government proposal to finance six motorway expansion projects aimed at improving congestion on the roads. It includes plans to widen one of the country’s major motorways to at least six lanes in key stretches between Bern and Zurich and between Geneva and Lausanne.
The overall proposal is set to cost CHF5.3 billion ($6.2 billion).
Is such an investment really necessary to cope with the increase in traffic? Or is it a waste of money and incompatible with Switzerland’s climate objectives, as some critics say?
Let us know your thoughts below. We want to hear your opinions.
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Voters to decide on major Swiss motorway expansion
Because it is an expansion and not cutting new right of way it is good alternative. The question is why some of us drive alone. Personally, when driving in Switzerland having a second set of eyes is a real benefit for me. However, with my mobility limitations using the rail or tram systems which I would prefer are not a real option. The problem I have is that to go anywhere you have to be able to walk to get to the train or tram or walk the streets to shop or just to enjoy what is around me that is not always an option. This the freedom of a car.
I suggest that we create a small car system for rent like we do for bicycles in the US and
create multi level budiligns near the commercial hubs throughout Switzerland and
mandate some financial incentive that people would park their cars in the multi level
parking lots, take a Swiss train and upont their desired arrival, they pick up a small car at these car rental stations. Swiss government could offer a special tax relief and intensive for this concept.
As a driver, I once asked other, predominantly male, drivers why they drive alone, and not take public transport, which works out cheaper. They all said "noise pollution" - people chatting loudly together or on phones, screaming children, often while their mums are on their phones. When I take public transport, I like to read, which is often impossible due to the noisy few, even if I wear noise blocking headphones. I think more people would take public transport and not drive if a) The noisy use of phones and other electronic devices was banned and b) There was a quiet section, e.g. at the back of a tram/train (yes, I know SBB have this in some 1st class, but it should be in 2nd class too). Here no one would be allowed to be noisy. Making public transport a quieter, more pleasurable experience, might reduce the number of quiet people driving.
The SBB used to be quiet carriages in 2nd class but I think they gave up with that idea due to the number of people totally ignoring it, chatting away and laughing etc and staff being constantly asked to police it.
I also remember that in those carriages headphones were also "banned", which is stupid really as I wear noise-cancelling headphones to not hear the other people, as best as one can..
The most annoying these days being those (oddly, the youngest and the oldest mostly..) who think it's normal to do video calls and have their phone's speaker on loud..
Germany has many more motorways, often with three or four lanes in each direction.
Does that mean there are fewer traffic problems there?
In the short term, increasing the capacity of often congested roads may bring relief, but in the medium term it leads to more traffic.
The bill is mainly paid by residents - and the environment.
We know this from better railway connections: People get used to it very quickly, plan with the fastest option as before and get just as annoyed about delays as before, despite the shorter journey time. Commuters will also be more stressed because the shorter journey times will be scheduled.
I also wonder whether the motorway itself is really causing the problem; commuters often queue at the exit or entrance, which then backs up onto the motorway.
On the other hand, I don't believe the argument that it is mainly foreigners who are to blame for our traffic problems. On the roads, there is a reciprocal right; we are allowed to drive on foreign roads just as much as "foreigners" are allowed to drive on our roads. That is in everyone's interest.
In Deutschland hat man viel mehr Autobahnen, oft mit drei oder vier Spuren pro Richtung.
Hat es deswegen dort weniger Verkehrsprobleme?
Kurzfristig mag eine Erhöhung der Kapazität oft überlasteter Strassen Erleichterung bringen, mittelfristig führt es zu Mehrverkehr.
Die Zeche bezahlen vor allem die Anwohner - und die Umwelt.
Man kennt es von besseren Bahnverbindungen: Man gewöhnt sich sehr schnell daran, plant wie schon früher mit der schnellsten Variante und ärgert sich trotz kürzerer Reisezeit genauso über Verspätungen wie früher. Die Berufsfahrer werden ebenfalls mehr gestresst sein, denn die kürzeren Fahrzeiten werden eingeplant werden.
Ich frage mich zudem, ob wirklich die Autobahn selber das Problem verursacht, Berufspendler stehen oft an der Ausfahrt oder Einfahrt Schlange, was sich dann auf die Autobahn zurückstaut.
Nichts halte ich dagegen vom Argument, es seien vor allem die Ausländer, die an unseren Verkhersproblemen schuld seien. Auf den Strassen herrscht Gegenrecht; wir dürfen genauso auf ausländischen Strassen unterwegs sein wie "die Ausländer" bei uns. Das ist im Interesse aller.
More environmental destruction???
just for an extra lane?
solo per una corsia in più?
There seems to be a reluctance to understand that the extraordinary sprawl of cities since 1950 is the result of growing access to the car and the increasingly generous infrastructure that is gradually being made available. As a result, people are moving further away from their centres of interest, while still spending the same amount of time commuting. But at much greater speed.
Clearly, people would not have travelled so far from their work in Geneva if the motorways had not been built. Maybe Geneva wouldn't have developed in the same way, but that's another story.
Increasing motorway capacity will undoubtedly increase the attractiveness of residential areas that are further away from places of work, leisure, shopping and so on. And that means more traffic. It would be a lie to say otherwise.
In 1970, Montreux, with its 20,000 vehicles a day, thought it would be able to relax with the opening of the motorway. Today there are 30,000 on the motorway, but ... 20,000 in Montreux.
The only sure way to reduce traffic jams on a motorway is to close it to traffic.
On semble ne pas vouloir comprendre que l'étalement extraordinaire de villes depuis 1950 résulte de l'accession croissante à l'automobile et aux infrastructures de plus en plus généreuses qui lui sont progressivement offertes. Ainsi les gens s'éloignent de leurs centres d'intérêt en consacrant toujours le même temps aux déplacements quotidiens. Mais à beaucoup plus grande vitesse.
A l'évidence, les gens ne se seraient pas éloignés autant de leur travail à Genève si les autoroutes ne s'étaient pas construites. Peut-être que Genève n'aurait pas connu le même développement, mais c'est une autre histoire.
En augmentant la capacité des autoroutes, on va à coup sûr accroître l'attractivité de lieux d'habitat plus éloignés des lieux de travail, de loisir, d'achat, etc. Donc favoriser un accroissement du trafic. C'est mentir que dire le contraire.
En 1970, Montreux et ses 20'000 véhicules/jour pensait souffler avec l'ouverture de l'autoroute. Or il y en a aujourd'hui 30'000 sur l'autoroute, mais ...20'000 dans Montreux.
La seule solution permettant à coup sûr de résorber les bouchons sur une autoroute, c'est de la fermer au trafic.
An absurd, not to say ridiculous, solution! Closing them to traffic would lead to the collapse of the entire country.
Soluzione assurda per non dire ridicola! Chiuderle al traffico porterebbe al collasso l'intero paese.
It might be ridiculous, but the scenario described is exactly what has happened all ever Europe since the car became the standard commuting method since the 1960s.
Can you suggest any alternatives? I would suggest road pricing (and hence higher charges at commuting times to encourage the use of public transport) but no government has the guts to do it as it's electoral suicide..
Another solution could be free public transport in and around cities. Vienna (greater Vienna, not just the centre) has a yearly ticket for 340.- Sfr per YEAR, that encourages use of public transport.
Similarly, the price of a ÖBB GA in Austria is around 1000.- Sfr per YEAR, these are real attempts to see what impact such pricing has on people's commuting habits, and what do the Swiss government do? - suggets building more reads! Just pathetic really..
Switzerland is not Vienna! Importing other metropolitan realities is just misguided politics. E.g. in Zurich it is easy to transport almost everyone with its powerful or formidable tram network, but what do you want to do in e.g. Ticino, where everything is scattered and even buses in the centres have almost no lanes?
Tear down every house or almost every house in Lugano, just to make room for public transport?
You try putting such nonsense to a popular vote!
La Svizzera non è Vienna! Importare altre realtà metropolitane è solo politichetta fuorviante. Ad es. a Zurigo è facile trasportare quasi tutti con la sua potente o formidabile rete tramviaria, ma che vuoi fare ad es. nel Ticino, dove tutto quanto è sparpagliato e persino i bus nei centri non hanno quasi corsie preferenziali?
Abbattere tutte le case o quasi di Lugano, solo per far posto ai mezzi pubblici?
Tu prova a sottoporre in votazione popolare una scemenza simile!
Any vote to limit people's personal mobility will of course fail and I agree that public transport solutions for cities can't always apply to rural areas, but somehow there has to be un understanding that vehicle traffic is the inevitable result of 40-50 years of unlimited choice of where to live and where to work and how to travel between the two, and the end result is mass congestion during commuting times unless you can change these attitudes and/or transport methods..
As long as it is much cheaper to make a long journey with two people in a car than on a train, road expansion will make no sense. I live at the foot of the San Bernadino Pass and I see the number of vehicles, especially large campervans, lorries and foreign-registered cars, that use the A13 southbound; there are days when you feel like you're in Germany or the Netherlands when you look at the traffic. Who are we building roads for? For the Swiss who live here and pay the 40 franc a year vignette, which increases petrol prices and taxes, or for foreign motorists who often don't even stop to buy petrol or food, but drive through Switzerland because it's cheap (40 francs) and comfortable. Large caravans, possibly with trailers, often cause major traffic jams in the mountains, because they impede the flow of traffic. I know from acquaintances that they never buy a vignette because it's not checked. The more we improve the roads, the more attractive they become for passing guests who don't contribute a cent to the costs. Does this require the support of the Swiss people, the taxpayer?
So lange es viel billiger ist schon mit zwei Personen im Auto anstatt im Zug eine groessere Strecke zu fahren macht der Ausbau der Strassen keinen Sinn. Ich lebe am Fusse des San Bernadino Passes und sehe wieviel Verkehr, vor allem grosse Wohnmobils, Lastwagen und Autos mit ausländischem Kennzeichen hier auf der A 13 in den Süden fahren; es gibt Tage da meint man in Deutschland oder den Niederlanden zu sein wenn man sich den Verkehr anschaut. Fuer wen genau bauen wir die Strassen aus? Fuer die Schweizer die hier leben und die 40.00 Fr. Vignette jaehrlich höhere Benzin Preise und Steuern bezahlen oder fuer die ausländischen Autofahrer die oefters nicht einmal fuer Benzin oder Essen anhalten aber durch die Schweiz fahren weil es billig (Fr. 40.00) und bequem ist. Die grossen Wohnwagen, eventuell noch mit Anhänger, sind hier öfters ein Grund fuer grossen Stau in den Bergen da sie den Verkehr behindern. Von Bekannten weiss ich, dass sie nie eine Vignette kaufen, es wird ja gar nicht geprüft. Je mehr wir die Strassen ausbauen um so attraktiver machen wir es fuer Durchfahr Gäste die keinen Rappen zu den Kosten beitragen. Braucht das die Unterstützung des Schweizer Volkes, des Steuerzahlers?
Yes, we Swiss abroad are also ready to vote on 25 September 2024. The only problem is that many of us, if not an estimated majority, are not receiving the voting material until two to three weeks AFTER the polling date. In principle, this is due to the Post Office, which has increasingly reduced its services. But this is no excuse for the Swiss authorities. Because sending voting and election documents to voters is a debt owed to them! There are (private) courier and express services that deliver the documents reliably to the addressee within a few days. Are the votes of the Swiss abroad worth less?
Ja, auch wir Auslandschweizer sind bereit, unsere Stimme am 25. September 2024 abzugeben. Das Problem ist einzig, dass viele, ja sogar eine geschätzte Mehrheit von uns die Stimmunterlagen erst etwa zwei bis drei Wochen NACH dem Abstimmungstermin erhalten. Das liegt grundsätzlich an der Post, die ihre Dienste mehr und mehr abgebaut hat. Dies ist aber keine Entschuldigung für die CH-Behörden. Denn das Zustellen von Wahl- und Abstimmungsunterlagen an die Stimmbürger ist eine Bringschuld! Es gibt ja (private) Kurier- und Expressdienste, die die Sendungen zuverlässig innerhalb von wenigen Tagen dem Empfänger zustellen. Sind die Stimmen der Auslandschweizer weniger wert?
An excellent question. Thank you for asking it. Perhaps we should ask the Swiss abroad.
Politicians who also make a name for themselves in, shall we say, notarial practice? That's the whole point. When you weigh up interests, you tip the scales. And as "all bodies immersed" .... Well then, evolution didn't happen in a day, it took a little longer, whatever the intelligentsia say...
Excellente question. Merci de l’avoir posée. Il faudrait peut-être demander au si la prompte organisation des Suisse de l’étranger.
Genre politiciens qui s’illustrent également dans des études, lâchons le mot, notarial ? Toute la question est là. A peser les intérêts, on fait pencher les balances. Et comme « tout corps plongés …. » Bon ensuite, l’évolution ne s’est pas faites en un seul jour, ça a pris un peu plus de temps n’est déplaise à l’intelligentsia
THE METHODS OF 1980 are no longer appropriate in 2025-2035
LES methodes de 1980 ne sont plus de mise en 2025-2035
And what are the alternatives? The rail network has already reached its limits, despite the billions invested. What we need to do is reduce the amount of unnecessary commuting (from where?) and also convince people to live closer to their place of work. But everyone wants the American-style cottage with swimming pool and garden, even far from the centre. Not to mention the fact that the United States has plenty of space, which is not the case in Switzerland, not at all!
E quali sarebbero le alternative?? La rete ferroviaria è già giunta al limite pure lei, nonostante i miliardi investiti. Piuttosto bisognerebbe ridurre la mania di viaggiare inutilmente anche per "evasione" (da che cosa poi?) e anche convincere la gente di abitare più vicino al posto di lavoro. Ma tutti vogliono la villetta all' americana con piscina e giardino, poco importa se lontana dal centro. Senza contare che gli USA hanno spazio in sovrabbondanza, ma la Svizzera no, per niente!
Indeed: everything must be upgraded, including roads!
Infatti: tutto va potenziato, strade comprese!
In 1964, during EXPO 64, a motorway linking Geneva to Lausanne was opened to traffic. Switzerland had a population of 5.8 million. 60 years later, Switzerland's population has grown by 55% to 9 million. It's not a question of meeting future needs, but of meeting current needs, and no more. If the population were to increase further, other, more fundamental problems would have to be resolved.
En 1964, lors de l'EXPO 64, une autoroute reliant Genève à Lausanne s'ouvrait à la circulation. La Suisse comptait 5.8 millions d'habitants. 60 ans plus tard, la population Suisse à augmenté de 55% atteignant 9 millions d'habitants. Il s'agit non pas de répondre aux besoins futures mais de répondre aux besoins actuels, pas plus. Si la population devait encore augmenter, se sont d'autres problèmes, plus fondamentaux, qui seront à résoudre.
Limit immigration at last!
Limitare finalmente l'immigrazione !
75% or more of the motorists who drive south on the A13 and then return to Switzerland are Germans, Dutch, Italians, Belgians and, this summer, more often British. Cars and motorhomes travelling south through Switzerland, perhaps stopping to fill up with petrol. They pay exactly the same price for the vignette and are the main cause of traffic jams, especially from Thursday to Tuesday. Our Oev costs keep rising because neither the Confederation nor the cantons are apparently interested in making these costs more affordable for Swiss taxpayers who use the bus and train to get to work. It's often cheaper to take the car than the train or bus, and therefore less of an incentive. If I go to Austria, I have to buy their vignette for the duration of my stay. Switzerland sticks to its one-price vignette. It no longer makes any sense. There is also no loading of cars onto trains across Switzerland, which should be compulsory for many foreigners who would have to load their cars in order to improve congestion and contribute more fairly to the costs of building and maintaining traffic in Switzerland. The endless road construction work that goes on for years is also a huge problem. Who are we really doing this for? For the people who commute to work every day, or for the tourists who like to cross Switzerland from north to south because it's quick and cheap?
75 und mehr Prozent der Autoschilder die Richtung Süden fahren auf der A13 und dann Sparer zurück sind Deutsche, Niederländer, Italiener, Belgier und in diesem Sommer öfters auch Engländer. Autos und Wohnmobil die durch die Schweiz in den Süden fahren und vielleicht für einmal Benzin auftanken stoppen. Sie bezahlen genau das gleiche für die Vignette und sind der größte Grund für Stau vor allem von Donnerstag bis Dienstag. Unsere Oev Kosten gehen ständig in die Höhe weil scheinbar weder Bund noch Kanton daran interessiert sind diese Kosten für der Schweizer Steuerzahler der Bus und Zug zur Arbeit braucht mehr erschwinglich zu machen. Es ist öfters billiger das Auto zu fahren denn Zug und Bus , so überhaupt wenig Motivation. Wenn ich nach Österreich fahre muss ich ihr Pickerl kaufen für die Länge meines Aufenthaltes. Die Schweiz hält an ihrer ein Preis Vignette fest. Das macht überhaupt nicht mehr Sinn. Auch kein Verladen von Autos durch die Schweiz auf Zügen gibt es , das sollte zwingend sein für viele Ausländer die verladen müssten um die Stauss zu verbessern und um ihren mehr gerechten Beitrag an den Schweizer Verkehrs Bau und Unterhaltungskosten beizusteuern. Die ewigen Strassenbausrbeiten die sich über Jahre ziehen sind ebenfalls ein Riesen Problem. Für wen tun wir das wirklich? Für die Bürger die täglich zur Arbeit fahren oder für die Touristen die es toll finden von Norden in den Süden durch die Schweiz fahren weil es schnell und billig ist?
The past few years have shown us that we need to reconsider our way of thinking and also make choices for the future and stop only considering the present.
Do we want to drive or eat? Because you can't expect to replant a field after building a motorway. So the fundamental question is:
Potatoes or bitumen.
As a general rule, let's not make agriculture disappear in order to drive faster....
Les années passées nous ont démontré que nous devons reconsidérer notre manière de penser et également de faire des choix pour le futur et arrêter de ne considérer que le présent.
Est-ce que nous voulons rouler ou manger ? Car vous ne pouvez espérer refaire un champs après avoir construit une autoroute. alors la question fondamentale est :
Pomme de terre ou bitume.
En règle générale ne faisons pas disparaitre l'agriculture pour rouler plus vite....
This is absurd, given that we are no longer self-sufficient in any area, least of all food!
Ragionamento assurdo, visto che non siamo più autosufficienti in nessun ambito, tanto meno quello alimentare!
Let's hope we don't have to go through these difficult times again.
But that's how life goes, you think you're on the way up and then one day you can suddenly come back down.
I wish you a pleasant ride on the motorways, rather than in a field or a forest.
Il nous faut espérer que nous n'ayons pas à revivre une fois ces moments difficiles.
Mais ainsi va la vie, on se croit en ascension et un jour on peut redescendre brusquement.
bonne promenade à vous sur les autoroutes, plutôt que dans un champs ou une forêt
I find these discussions with politicians extremely boring. I'm more interested in what researchers and people with practical experience have to say. Almost 20 years ago, I myself was a member of the support group for the extension of the Baregg tunnel. Even then, the transport planners could tell us exactly where the next traffic jams would be after the Baregg tunnel was extended. At that time, too, agricultural land had to be used up, and Switzerland's food supply would deteriorate even further as a result of the extension.
The arguments are exactly the same as they were then, and traffic jams have continued to increase despite the extension.
Ich finde dies Diskussionen mit Politikern äusserst langweilig. Mich interessieren vielmehr was die Forschung sagt und Menschen die ganz praktische Erfahrungen haben. Vor bald 20 Jahren war ich selbst in der Begleitgruppe Ausbau Baregg Tunnel. Die Verkehrsplaner konnten uns schon damals sehr genau sagen, wo nach dem Ausbau des Baregg Tunnels die nächsten Staus entstehen. Auch damals musste Landwirtschaftsland genutzt werden und wurde damit die Lebensmittelversorgung der Schweiz durch den Ausbau weiter verschlechtert.
Die Argumente sind genau die gleichen wie damals und die Staus haben trotz Ausbau weiter zugenommen.
If that were the case, the whole of Ticino without motorways would have collapsed by now! So much for 19th century romanticism!
Beh, se così, fosse tutto il Ticino senza autostrade sarebbe già collassato! Bando al romanticismo ottocentesco!
I don't understand the "more roads = more traffic" argument. The number of existing vehicles is not increasing because of the extension of the roads. Do the opponents think that anyone is going to buy an extra car or drive back and forth on the motorway for pleasure? And: if someone has a season ticket for public transport, they're probably not going to get on the road to commute.
Das Argument "Mehr Strassen = mehr Verkehr kann ich nicht nachvollziehen. Die vorhandene Anzahl Fahrzeuge wird duch den Ausbau von Strassen nicht grösser. Oder glauben die Gegner, dass sich jemand ein zusätzliches Fahrzeug anschafft, oder aus Jux und Tollerei mit seinem PKW ein wenig auf der Autobahn hin und her fährt. Und: Wenn jemand ein Abonnement des ÖV besitzt, wird er wohl kaum zum Pendeln auf die Strasse wechseln.
The opponents are all from the ideologically red-green political sector: they are then the first to cry inefficiency when they can no longer get around by car in a decent time! It's always the same thing: "Neinsager" for pure ideology!
Le opposizioni provengono tutte quante dal settore politico ideologizzato rosso-verde: sono poi i primi a gridare all'inefficienza quando non possono più spostarsi in auto in tempi decenti! Siamo alle solite: "Neinsager" per ideologia pura!
The widening of motorways in Switzerland raises many questions about mobility and the environment, but also about the duration of the work and the nuisance it causes. Widening projects can extend over several years, leading to traffic jams, noise and increased pollution throughout this period. Furthermore, will society and businesses have the human and material resources to carry out all the urgent measures required by climate change?
With the increase in the volume of car traffic, it is crucial to consider the ecological consequences of these projects. Pollution and climate objectives could be compromised.
Rather than expanding, why not optimise our existing infrastructure and encourage the use of alternative, low-cost modes of transport?
By developing living and working areas close to our homes and adapting our public policies, we can reduce car journeys. Awareness-raising campaigns are also essential to promote more environmentally-friendly behaviour.
Together, let's think about sustainable mobility that respects our planet, without adding to the nuisance of our daily lives!
L'élargissement des autoroutes en Suisse soulève de nombreuses questions sur la mobilité et l'environnement, mais aussi sur la durée des travaux et les nuisances qu'ils engendrent. Les projets d'élargissement peuvent s'étendre sur plusieurs années, entraînant des embouteillages, du bruit et une pollution accrue durant toute cette période. Par ailleurs, la société, les entreprises auront-elles les ressources humaines et matérielles pour réaliser toutes les mesures urgentes que nécessite le dérèglement climatique.
Avec l'augmentation du volume de trafic automobile, il est crucial de réfléchir aux conséquences écologiques de ces projets. La pollution et les objectifs climatiques risquent d'être compromis.
Plutôt que d'élargir, pourquoi ne pas optimiser nos infrastructures existantes et encourager l'utilisation de modes de transport alternatifs et bon marché.
En développant des zones de vie et de travail proche de nos habitations et en adaptant nos politiques publiques, nous pouvons réduire les déplacements en voiture. Des campagnes de sensibilisation sont également essentielles pour promouvoir des comportements plus respectueux de l'environnement.
Ensemble, réfléchissons à une mobilité durable qui respecte notre planète, sans ajouter de nuisances à notre quotidien !
It is absolutely essential to find a solution to the huge volume of car traffic entering and leaving the city of Basel. Congestion is inevitable. Basel is the border with Germany and France, the entry and exit point for the transport of goods and other foreign products. This is a matter of urgency!
È assolutamente necessario cercare una soluzione all'enorme traffico automobilistico per entrare e uscire da Basilea città. La congestione è inevitabile. Basilea è il confine con la Germania e la Francia, è l'ingresso e l'uscita per il trasporto di merci e altri prodotti stranieri. E ' urgente!
It seems obvious to me, just like the Lugano-Chiasso motorway section!
MI sembra ovvio, così come il tratto autostradale Lugano-Chiasso!
About ten years ago, I attended an event organised by one of Switzerland's most renowned and recognised engineering consultancies. The theme was "Building roads means harvesting traffic". Throughout Switzerland, we are constantly extending our road network, which is already very well developed, throughout the country.
What we don't think about enough is the billions it costs not only to build but also to maintain existing roads. In many European countries, the maintenance and upgrading of the existing road network is already being neglected for lack of money. The current debate in the Swiss parliament shows that we are also moving in this direction, and that we are starting to make savings almost everywhere.
So today we should be thinking less about building new roads and talking more about the reasons why motorised traffic continues to grow. It's not because the population is growing. In fact, a great many people already don't have a car. There are completely different reasons for this growth, and we should be doing something about them, so that people spend fewer hours each day travelling to their workplaces, which are becoming further and further away.
Vor ca. 10 Jahren war ich an einer Veranstaltung eines renommiertesten und anerkanntesten Planungsbüros der Schweiz. Das Thema lautet "Wer Strassen baut, erntet den Verkehr. In der ganzen Schweiz bauen wir landesweit unser bereits heute sehr gut ausgebautes Strassennetz laufend weiter aus.
Woran wir dabei zu wenig denken ist, wie viele Milliarden nicht nur der Bau, sondern auch der laufende Unterhalt der bereits bestehenden Strassen kostet. In sehr vielen Ländern Europa kommt bereits heute aus Mangel an Geld der Unterhalt und die ganze Sanierung des bestehenden Strassennetzes zu kurz. Die aktuelle Diskussion im Parlament der Schweiz, dass auch wir in diese Richtung gehen und fast überall zu sparen beginnen.
Wir sollten deshalb heute weniger über den Bau von neuen Strassen nachdenken sondern vielmehr darüber reden, warum der motorisierte Verkehr weiter zunimmt. Die Zunahme der Bevölkerung ist es nämlich nicht. Denn ganz viele Menschen haben bereits heute gar kein Auto. Es sind ganz andere Gründe, die zu diesem Wachstum führen und diese Gründe sollten wir beeinflussen so dass die Menschen auch weniger Stunden jeden Tag zu immer weiter entfernten Orten an Ihre Arbeitsplätze fahren müssen.
What do you mean by "not population growth"? Since I was born, the Swiss population has tripled (!) and road traffic even more. What else do you want to solve? Maybe bicycles or horses? Let's not be ridiculous and look beyond our borders: everywhere, motorways have been widened to at least six lanes, otherwise there would have been a total collapse in traffic. As usual, the Greens and the leftists are out of touch with reality.
Come sarebbe che "non è l'aumento della popolazione" ?? Da quando sono nato ad oggi la popolazione svizzera è triplicata (!) e il traffico stradale anche più. Che si vuole risolvere altrimenti? : forse con le bici o con i cavalli ? Non siamo ridicoli e guardiamo anche oltre il nostro orticello: ovunque le autostrade sono state allargate ad almeno sei corsie, altrimenti sarebbe avvenuto il totale collasso del traffico. Verdi e sinistra come al solito sono fuori dalla realtà.
When we stop importing companies with all their staff, plus cross-border commuters, we won't need to build any more roads, that's the problem, they absolutely want Switzerland to have 10 million inhabitants, it's profitable, but always for the same people, the native Swiss get poorer while the immigrants and cross-border commuters get richer with our strong franc.
Quand on arrêtera d'importer des entreprises avec tous leurs personnels , plus les frontaliers , on aura pas besoin de construire plus de routes, le problème est là, ils veulent absolument une Suisse à 10 millions, ça rapporte , mais toujours aux mêmes, le Suisse d'origine s'appauvrit pendant que les immigrés et frontaliers s'enrichissent avec notre franc fort
That may be so, but hindering immigration is taboo for Switzerland, both for the red-greens and for industry and business!
Può starci, ma ostacolare l'immigrazione è un tabù per La Svizzera, sia per i rosso-verdi, sia per l'industria e le aziende!
The argument for extending motorways is that wider motorways reduce congestion...
The argument against is based on numerous studies that show the opposite and that the only effective way in the long term is to create viable alternatives. There are no real arguments. This money should be invested in increasing the range of transport services or reducing the price of taking them.
L'argument pour l'extension des autoroutes est que des autoroutes plus larges réduisent les embouteillages...
L'argument contre site de nombreuses études qui montrent le contraire et que la seule façon efficace à long terme est de créer des alternatives viables. Il n'y a pas vraiment d'arguments. Cet argent devrait être investi pour augmenter l'offre des transports ou bien de réduire le prix pour les prendre
Quite the contrary: if the United States, for example, had kept two-lane roads like ours, the whole transport system would already have collapsed. And not just in the United States: have you ever seen the 12-lane roads in China or other more developed Asian countries?
Macché il contrario: se ad es. gli USA avessero mantenuto delle autostrade a due corse per marcia come le nostre, sarebbe già collassato tutto il sistema dei trasporti. E non solo per gli USA: mai viste le strade a 12 corsie di Cina o di altri paesi più sviluppati dell'Asia ?Qui si sta sognando invece di ragionare!
None, I always have a clear path
Keine, ich habe immer freie Fahrt.
In Switzerland, there is no overall transport concept that determines which modes of mobility serve the most economical and appropriate function within and between residential areas. On the other hand, residential areas should be designed to minimise mobility. Before investing in transport modes, the resources and quality of the living environment should be assessed.
In der Schweiz fehlt ein Gesamtverkehrskonzept, welches festhält, welche Mobilitätsträger in den jeweiligen Siedlungsräumen und zwischen den Siedlungsräumen die wirtschaftlichste und zweckmässigste Funktion haben. Im weiteren sind die Siedlungsräume so auszubilden, dass möglichst wenig Mobilität entsteht. Dann ist der Aspekt der Ressourcen und Wohnqualität zu beurteilen bevor Investitionen in Verkehrsträger getätigt werden.
That's easy to say, but what solutions are you proposing, romantic ideology aside?
Facile a dirlo: ma che soluzioni proponi, ideologia romantica a parte?
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