What do you think about voting on the same issues multiple times?
Swiss citizens on Sunday voted on the Covid-19 law for a third time. In Switzerland, citizens can contest existing laws by initiating a referendum.
What do you think about voting on the same issue multiple times? What do you think about the Swiss political system of referendums and people’s initiatives? Join the discussion!
It's all a story. The media are controlled by the Swiss franc lobbies and manage these consultations at will. And there are still unbelievers that decide something .... Yes... maybe those lobbies let them decide what time the gas stations close... but about something more serious? Forget about it
Todo es un cuento. A ver si nos enteramos de una vez !Los medios estan controlados por los lobbies del franco suizo y manejan esas consultas a placer. Y todavia hay incredulos que deciden algo …. Si… igual esos lobbies les dejan decidir sobre a que hora cierran las gasolinberas … pero sobre algo mas serio? Olvidaros
I am in favor of a referendum system, where a referendum is held. It is important for each citizen to think for himself/herself, have an opinion, and express it. In Japan, people can effectively only vote for politicians, which means that they vote based on the party's position at the time.
国民投票を行う、レファレンダム制度に賛成です。国民一人一人が自分で考えて意見を持ち、表明することは大事。日本は事実上、政治家に投票することしかできないため、その時々の政党の党勢から判断して投票することになってしまう。
Japanese.
I am in favor of a referendum or a system where people can challenge a law. I think it is good no matter how many times it happens, because Covid-19 the situation is changing.
I don't know about other countries, but in Japan there is an unspoken rule that we should not discuss politics with our friends and teachers. Furthermore, there are almost no politics classes in compulsory education or high school. It exists as a subject to be memorized for exams, but there is no discussion.
This may be one of the reasons why Japanese people (especially young people) have very little interest in politics. In the House of Representatives election held in 2021, 43.21% of the respondents were in their teens, 36.50% were in their 20s, and 47.12% were in their 30s.
In the House of Councillors election held in 2022, the turnout was very low: 35.42% of those in their teens, 33.99% of those in their 20s, and 44.80% of those in their 30s. (In Japan, the voting age has recently been lowered from 20 to 18.)
In addition, Japan does not have a referendum where people can challenge a law or be involved in legal decisions. (If you get tens of millions of signatures, maybe it is possible.)
So, the fact that there is a referendum is a good thing in itself.
Young people have given up on the idea that their vote will change anything in society; if it was a vote on the pros and cons of one issue, they might be more inclined to go out and vote, thinking that their vote might make a difference.
日本人です。
国民投票や法律に異議を唱えられる制度は賛成です。何度あっても良いと思います。Covid-19は情勢が変わっていくので。
他の国の方はどうかわかりませんが、日本では友人や先生達と政治の話はしてはいけないという暗黙のルールがあります。さらに、義務教育や高校では政治の授業もほとんどありません。試験のための暗記科目としては存在しますが、議論などはしません。
それもあってか日本人(特に若者)の政治への関心はとても低く、2021年に行われた衆議院選挙では10歳代が43.21％、20歳代が36.50％、30歳代が47.12％。
2022年に行われた参議院選挙では、10歳代が35.42％、20歳代が33.99％、30歳代が44.80％ととても投票率が低いです。(日本では最近投票権を持つ年齢が20から18歳に下がった)
また、日本には法律に異議を唱えることができたり、法律決定に関わる国民投票が行われません。(何千万人もの署名を集めたら、もしかしたら可能かもしれません。)
なので、国民投票があるということ自体が良いことだと思います。
若い人たちは、自分の一票では社会は何も変わらないと諦めています。１つの問題についての是非を問うような投票だったら、自分の一票で何か変わるかもしれないと思って投票に行くようになってくれるかもしれません。
Before you decide to silence people you must understand why they request the vote in the first place. With Covid there is a clear fear and distrust about something, from almost half of the population that voted. Also those who are the most affected by the covid law do not have the right to vote (children, young people and foreigners) We must vote as many times as people request for it.
Hi ANONA, people were not silenced - there were [url=https://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/politics/swiss-voters-likely-to-back-covid-19-law/48599666]three votes on the topic of Covid[/url], and the majority of voters decided to support the measures every time. But I do agree that it is important to understand why people go through the effort of collecting enough signatures to bring an issue to vote. I also find your input on voting right very interesting - there are lots of discussions around young people and foreigners voting:
[url=https://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/politics/voting-rights---the-foreign-community-is-too-big-to-be-ignored-/47098792]Voting rights: ‘The foreign community is too big to be ignored’[/url]
[url=https://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/foreigner-voting-rights/29288474]Foreigner voting rights[/url]
[url=https://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/politics/youth-parliaments---the-springboard-of-swiss-democracy/48526042]Youth parliaments – the springboard of Swiss democracy[/url]
[url=https://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/politics/opinion_time-to-let-16-and-17-year-olds-vote/44983684]It’s time to let 16- and 17-year-olds vote[/url]
[url=http://https://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/opinion_are-16-year-olds-mature-enough-to-vote--no-/44986716]Are 16-year-olds mature enough to vote? No.[/url]
From Japan.
I think the Swiss political system is very democratic and very good.
The fact that there are several national-level referendums on the same issue may be silly at times. But at least it is much better than indifference. Besides, in my opinion, the Swiss political system works quite well and reflects the will of the people.
日本から。
私は、スイスの政治システムは民主主義的で非常に良いと思います。
同じ問題について国レベルの国民投票が何回も行われるというのは、時にはくだらないとうこともあるかもしれない。しかし、少なくとも、無関心よりははるかに良い。それに、私にはスイスの政治システムはかなりよく機能していて、民意が反映された政治が行われていると思う。
As older voters die off, and younger people become eligible to vote, there should be regular repeat votes on the same issue, say every 5 years or so. Also, foreigners should have the right to vote where they live, if they are working and pay taxes there. Imagine if there were another Brexit vote now (7 years later), I think the result would be remain.
Hi LYNX, thank you for your contribution! Do you mean established regular votes? Which topics do you think would be good to vote on regularly?
Foreigners have voting rights in some cantons - you can find more information here: [url]https://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/foreigner-voting-rights/29288474[/url]
I agree that people change and situations change. Voting on same topic can be scheduled like 5-10 years apart but not sooner.
With regard to the history, It seems not the best idea to give foreigners the right to vote.
Lets remember the Sack of Rome (455) or the Anschluss of Austria 1938 to Germany. With a right to vote it will be easier to do an Anschluss an eliminate the peace.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Migration_Period
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sack_of_Rome_(455)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anschluss
Should people who vote not have a heart for the natives so that peace remain?
Further, how can the people and the economy have a stable situation if every 5 years everything could change?
This is why the Swiss have never had an empire and only occupy land smaller than Greater London. That, and not having a sea or an ocean to help invade other countries. If you pay taxes here, you should be allowed to vote here, regardless of your nationality. Or don't tax foreigners.
I know foreigners can vote in some places, not all. But they should be allowed to vote in their community, canton and nationally, but only if they make a positive contribution by working. Not those that live on handouts. Regular topics - basic income, more holidays, less tax, a national health system, joining the EU (now the UK is out, it would be nice if my CH passport was also an EU one), making English a national language (I think it's already Nr 2 most spoken). Often there are great topics never to be heard of again, as the Swiss tend to look at how much it will cost them as individuals rather than the benefit for specific groups. Quite often if something is good for the poor, the rich Swiss vote against it.
Democracy, so much praised by all Western countries, is nothing more than a deception for the people who believe that they elect the governments.
Nothing could be further from the truth, for example with this hypothesis:
- General elections are called to elect the government. 20 parties compete for power.
- There is 57% abstention, people who, like me, believe that it makes no difference who governs.
- 43% of the votes are for the most representative parties of left and right, the rest of the votes are for the small parties of no significance.
- These small parties will be the key to obtain the government.
- They will make impossible pacts, in exchange for benefits for the small parties, which will make a big deal and will put pressure on the possible allied party as they see fit.
-Governments like the Spanish one, with alliances with ETA terrorists, neo communists who are despised by most of the people.
We obtain, a Mr. Sanchez who lying to his own voters, promising that he would never ally with communists and ETA terrorists, after the elections, goes back on his promises, betraying the people who have neither elected him, nor elected his allies... what kind of Democracy are we talking about... an illusory lie that deceives the people.
La Democracia tan loada por todos los países occidentales, no es más que un engaño para el pueblo que cree que elige a los Gobiernos.
Nada más lejos de la realidad, por ejemplo con esta hipótesis:
- Se convocan elecciones generales para elegir el Gobierno. 20 partidos concurren para detentar el poder.
- Hay 57% abstención, gente que como yo, cree que da igual quién gobierne
- El 43% de votos son para los partidos más representivos de izquierda y derecha, el resto de votos son para los partidillos carentes de significancia.
- Esos partidillos serán la clave para obtener el gobierno
- Harán pactos imposibles, a cambio de beneficios para los partidillos, que sacarán pecho y presionarán a conveniencia al posible partido que se alíe.
-Gobiernos como el español, con alianzas con terroristas etarras, neo comunistas que son despreciados por la mayor parte del pueblo.
Obtenemos, un señor Sánchez que mintiendo a sus propios electores, prometiendo que jamás se aliaría con comunistas y etarras, tras las elecciones, se retracta de sus promesas, traicionando a ese pueblo que ni lo ha elegido, ni ha elegido a sus aliados… de qué tipo de Democracia estamos hablando… de una mentira ilusoria que engaña al pueblo.
Good morning, you have written my words. I am disappointed that Switzerland has been just as manipulated with the covid issue, and the "alleged" vaccine that, at least in Spain continues to kill poor grandparents in old people's homes, where they are injected with an unproven substance that has very serious side effects, under threat of being kicked out if they refuse.
My parents, both of them, have died from the injections, which has broken my soul, I will never forgive the criminal scum politicians, nor those who call themselves doctors, who keep silent even knowing that this is a crime against humanity, I laugh at the Hitler, Stalin, Mao... the sophistication used by the wrongly called vaccine has produced and is producing millions of deaths, with the consent of Governments. Scientists, Journalists, Doctors ... I hope I do not live too long to see and suffer the society of manipulated and abhorred fools that this world is becoming.
Buenos días, ha escrito usted mis palabras. Siento decepción que Suiza haya sido igual de manipulada con el tema covid, y la “presunta” vacuna que, al menos en España sigue matando a los pobres abuelos en residencias de ancianos, donde son inyectados con una substancia no probada y que tiene muy serios efectos secundarios, bajo amenaza de echarlos si se niegan.
Mis padres, ambos, han muerto por las inyecciones, lo que me ha partido el alma, nunca perdonaré a los políticos basurientos criminales, ni a esos que se denominan médicos, que callan aún sabiendo que esto es un crimen contra la humanidad, me rio de los Hitler, Stalin, Mao… la sofisticación empleada por la mal llamada vacuna ha producido y está produciendo millones de muertes, con la anuencia de Gobiernos. Científicos, Periodistas, Médicos … Espero no vivir demasiado para ver y padecer la sociedad de tontos manipulados y aborregados en que se está convirtiendo este mundo
My goodness, Parliament never does its job, as the elected representatives of the people, so the people have to decide every time and, unfortunately, this same Parliament never does its job, again, to enforce. There are many examples of this: second homes, the LAT, Covid, via secura, the climate and so on.
Ma foi, le Parlement ne faisant jamais son travail, comme élu du peuple, le peuple doit à chaque fois trancher et, malheureusement, ce même Parlement ne fait ensuite jamais son travail, encore, pour faire appliquer. De nombreux cas en exemples, les résidences secondaires, la LAT, le Covid, via secura, le climat et j'en passe.
Democracy is participation. So very good that the people were called upon to approve or reject the law.
An important issue-preparatory to informed and informed voting-is the issue of public and private information and whether it was sufficient and free of propagandistic overtones or elements.
La democrazia è partecipazione. Quindi molto bene che i popolo sia stato chiamato ad approvare o respingere la legge.
Una questione importante - propedeutica al voto informato e consapevole - è il tema dell'informazione pubblica e privata e se questa è stata sufficiente e priva di toni o elementi propagandistici.
The Swiss people have rights that nearly no other people in the world have. When we discover that it was all a lie we will be the only people in the world with a legal and political capacity to right the wrong. Never let them take this away from us.
IN real life, it is all about perception. Swiss is a master of perception and also deception. Yes we all think our vote matters. Have our votes really translated to action on our opinion? More often than not, higher powers will review the votes and then decide "creatively" their own decision.
Hi HAT, could you provide sources on how "higher powers decide creatively their own decision"?
It is annoying. We expressed out vill, it feels like they try to change our opinion. We vote again and again only on subject that benefits the politicians. I wish we voted again about Serafe, like belug was cheaper... considering we are paying for services I have never used in my life. No TV connection, no radio in the car. Only Internet and monitors. Let's vote on that again? Oh no we are waisting money voting over and over about covid which made richer people more profits... let's do that
Hi LOL,
an interesting bit of information, SWI swissinfo.ch receives 50% of its funding from licence fees. You can find out more about us here: [url]https://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/about-swi[/url]
I think that when it comes to such a controversial subject, it's legitimate to discuss it again as the situation evolves. In this case, the situation has evolved enormously, even if the media are withholding information. The enormous economic and financial stakes involved do not allow the public to appreciate the full scope of the problem. It's worth noting the legendary fear and caution of the Swiss, who are asking to be protected, guided by "those in the know", even though we now know that they knew nothing about it.
As far as I'm concerned, we've totally missed the central event, which is in fact a worldwide hold-up of public funds by a small number of criminal enterprises, with the complicity of politicians under the guise of : It's for your own good!
Je trouve que lorsqu'il s'agit d'un sujet aussi controversé il est légitime d'en rediscuter selon l'évolution de la situation. En l’occurrence, la situation a énormément évolué même si les médias font de la rétention d'information. Les enjeux économiques et financiers énormes ne permettent pas à la population d'apprécier l'ensemble du problème. On peut relever la crainte et la prudence légendaire des suisses qui demandent à être protégés, guidés par "ceux qui savent" même si on le sait maintenant: ils n'en savaient rien.
Pour ma part, on est passé totalement à côté de l'événement central qui est en fait un hold-up mondial des fond publiques par un petit nombre d'entreprises criminelles avec la complicité des politiques sous couvert de : C'est pour votre bien!
The most powerful argument in favour of Swiss Democracy (and indeed all direct democracy) is that the people don't vote to abolish it, even though it is a straightforward process to call a referendum for that purpose.
That is not true of other systems of government. Those of us who live under elective government cannot move to direct democracy without the politicians agreeing to it. And as the politicians are almost universally opposed to that, it means somehow overturning the entire political establishment. Given their incumbency, access to political donations, and other advantages, that is an impossible task.
Whatever perceived defects some people might think Swiss Democracy has (and remember all systems of governments have defects in the eyes of some people ) Swiss-style Democracy is unique in being the only system that provides ongoing demonstration of its legitimacy in terms of popular support.
How often have people in Switzerland voted on AHV reform, greenhouse gases, immigration and other issues until it suited certain circles?
The Swiss are obviously used to voting on the same issues over and over again.
A philosopher once said: A democracy occasionally makes wrong decisions, but it can also correct these wrong decisions with new insights.
That is the 'beauty' of Swiss democracy...
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